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The M17 and The Marine Corps. Will the P320 retire the M9?

By
Keith Finch
-

By Travis Pike

Will the Marines Adopt the P320?

The big news in January was the Army’s declaration that the SIG P320 won the modular handgun trial. Needless to say, the folks at SIG Sauer’s Shot Show booth were quite excited. The SIG P320, equipped with a manual safety, would be the M17 in Army nomenclature.

The big question is will the other ground fighting force the United States Military uses adopt the pistol? I’m of course talking about the Marine Corps. The Marine Corps and the military as a whole has traditionally followed the movements of the Army.

Why the Marine Corps could adopt the Sig P320

  1. Logistics. Standardization is an important part of logistics for a combined fighting force. Plus the Army’s massive budget makes it capable of testing and evaluating new firearms more effectively than the other branches.

The Marine Corps can piggyback on their testing and save the funds necessary to test a completely different handgun. They can use the same contract process, and save a lot of time, and energy.

  1. The Marine Corps is looking to replace the M9 in the early 2020s according to the Marine Corps times. By then the SIG P320 will be in service with the Army and the Marine Corps will have a good idea of its success or failure.

Currently, the M9 is far from beloved with the United States Marines and troops have very little confidence in the weapon. The M9s in the armory are also quite old and have lived a rough life in my experience with the platform.

The Marine Corps has also expressed interest in having a modular handgun platform. The main fighting forces will be using the full-sized variant, and special operations may desire the compact variant. The SIG P320 offers that adaptability.

  1. The Marine Corps is currently working to modernize its combat fighting force. The Marine Corps is conducting experiments with infantry battalions to see what works and what doesn’t.

3rd Battalion, 5th Marines issued the M27 IAR to every infantry Marine during training and a deployment. The intent was to see how well an entire battalion of M27 equipped Marines could fight.

Three Companies from three different battalions issued every Marine a detachable suppressor for their rifles and machine guns. The intent was to see how the suppressors could improve on communication and warfighting ability.

If the Marine Corps is serious about modernizing, and want a pistol within the next 10 years the SIG P320 offers a very modern design.

  1. The SIG P320 appears to be the most modular handgun on the market. With the ability to swap different size frames and barrels with ease it makes sense for the Marines. One of the Modular Handgun directives was an option for accepting a suppressor. If the Marine Corps is interested in utilizing suppressor equipped weapons the SIG P320 is an off the shelf option.
The P226, like the M9, is a handgun older in service and may also be replaced by the P320/M17 putting military forces under one modular handgun

Why the Marine Corps may not adopt the SIG P320

  1. The Marine Corps is slowly edging away from standardization with the Army. The Global War on Terror made the Marine Corps’ arsenal unique. From the adoption of the ACOG to fielding the M16A4 until 2015. The Marines also kept the M4, instead of adopting the M4A1. They even decided to utilize a different 5.56 load than the Army.

The adoption of the M27 Infantry Automatic Rifle to replace the SAW was the biggest major change and move away from the Army’s arsenal. Now the Marines may be adopting the M27 as the standard infantry rifle, putting them further away from standardization with the Army.

  1. The wars in the Middle East blurred the lines of the Marine Corps unique mission profile. The Marine Corps is still an amphibious fighting force, even though they’ve spent almost two decades in the desert. The SIG P320 may not fit well in an amphibious role. Then again it may fit the role perfectly. The Army’s testing data may not be sufficient for the United States Marine Corps.
  1. The Glock 19 seems to have a place with the Marine Corps Special Operations Command. MARSOC units have adopted the Glock 19 and standardized the Glock 19 over the 1911 and M9 handguns. If the Glock 19 proves to be popular with MARSOC it could leak into the main Marine Corps community as a Marine tested and approved handgun.

Will it be the SIG?

Following the modernization in a post-Iraq and Afghan War world will be interesting. Our current President is dedicating a big chunk of money to the military, so now is an advantageous time to start shopping for handguns. If they choose to go a different route than the SIG Sauer P320, it will be a fascinating experiment.

Author with an issued M9

PRE-ORDER: Minuteman Watch Co. Collaboration with Southern Grind brings you limited edition Spider Monkey to support the Red Circle Foundation

By
Keith Finch
-

For those wanting to get right to business follow the link Here

But for the rest of the readers here is the news.

Minuteman Watch Co. owner Tom Carey has partnered with Zac Brown’s (yes that Zac Brown) Southern Grind knife company to produce a limited run of Minuteman USA Spider Monkey’s.

The Made in the USA knives feature an S35VN steel blade. For those not versed in steel.. that’s REALLY good blade steel. A G10 grip finishes off the package with the SG and MM USA Logos on the blade and belt clip. It’s a phenomenal knife.

Here’s why you should order the limited edition (ends on May 31st)

The Red Circle Foundation

RCF is a rapid funding project for the families of fallen SOF (Special Operational Forces) personnel. They do in hours what most relief funding initiatives take weeks to do when a family loses their loved one. They provide immediate emergency funding to help make things easier at home and keep the wheels on track while the mourn the fallen.

Your purchase helps RCF, proceeds on these knives are filling the tanks of Red Circle so they can send that money QRF style right to the next family that needs it.

Follow think links at the bottom of the Minuteman Watch Co. release from the link above or go right to it and order that steel here for $229.95 your knife will arrive after August at some point once complete.

Carry on readers

Rumor Mill: Executive Action to Define and Protect Militia Suitable Rifles

By
Keith Finch
-
LWRC, BG Defense, FNH SCAR

Disclaimer:

THIS IS CONJECTURE, SPECULATION, AND IN NO WAY OFFICIAL ACTION

But seen on Ammoland http://www.ammoland.com/2017/02/proposed-executive-order-designates-militia-rifles-citizen-ownership/#axzz4aDhukX3r

 

By the authority vested in me as President and Commander in Chief of the Militia by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, and in order to ensure the ability of citizens of the United States to defend themselves, their communities and their States, as well as to ensure the safety and security of our Nation, I hereby order as follows:

Section 1. Purpose. Both individual and community safety are critically important to the national security of the United States. Terrorism, transnational criminal activity and potential acts of war by foreign nations present a significant threat to national security and our citizens, who have the right and the duty to defend themselves, their communities, their States and the Nation.

Section 2. Policy. It is the policy of the executive branch to:

(a) Support and defend the Constitution, including the Second Amendment right of citizens to keep and bear arms for Militia purposes, as well as self-defense.
(b) Encourage citizens to be prepared to act as members of the Militia to defend communities, States and the Nation, as part of the common defense contemplated by the Constitution of the United States.
(c) Discourage restrictions by States and political subdivisions on individual possession of firearms suitable for Militia purposes by citizens of the United States.

Section 3. Definitions.
(a) “Militia” has the meaning given the term in Title 10, Section 311 of the United States Code to include the Unorganized Militia, as well as the meaning given to the term “Militia” under equivalent State statutes.
(b) “Self-Defense” shall mean the actions of citizens to defend themselves and their families from physical attack.
(c) “Communities” shall mean neighborhoods, towns, cities, counties and other political subdivisions of citizens who live in distinct geographic areas within a State.
(d) “State” shall mean one of the fifty States of the United States.
(e) “Militia Purposes” shall mean training, practice and preparedness which could improve the ability of a citizen to act, and to be armed in case of a need to act, as a current or future member of a local, State or National organization commanded by government officials and responsive to a physical threat. Appropriate organizations include those commanded by an elected county or city Sheriff; those commanded by the Governor of a State through officers of that State’s Defense Force as authorized by Title 30, Section 109 of the United States Code, or through officers of that State’s National Guard; and organizations commanded by the President through officers of the Active or Reserve components of U.S. Armed Forces.
(f) “Militia Rifles” shall mean the firearms designated in Section 4 that are made in America and suitable for use in self-defense, community defense, defense of States and defense of the Nation.

Section 4. Designation of Militia Rifles. That the following firearms and accessories are authorized and appropriate for individual citizens to keep and bear for Militia purposes under the Constitution and the laws of the United States:
(a) The AR-15 and similar semi-automatic rifles, to include flash suppressors and bayonet lugs, magazines of up to thirty round capacities, M-7 bayonets, and ammunition in 5.56 NATO or .223 Remington, in all quantities.
(b) The M1A and similar semi-automatic rifles, to include flash suppressors and bayonet lugs, magazines of up to twenty round capacities, M-6 bayonets, and ammunition in 7.62 NATO or .308 Winchester, in all quantities.
(c) The M1 Garand and similar semi-automatic rifles, to include flash suppressors and bayonet lugs, M-5 bayonets, and ammunition in .30-’06 Springfield, in all quantities.
(d) Bolt action rifles in the calibers of .30-’06 Springfield; 7.62 NATO or .308 Winchester; 5.56 NATO or .223 Remington; or any substantially equivalent caliber, and ammunition appropriate for the rifles, in any quantity.
(This list could easily be expanded or replaced by a broad definition.)

Section 5. Pre-emption. This Executive Order is intended to pre-empt the laws of States or political subdivisions that infringe upon the rights of citizens to keep and bear the arms designated in Section 4.

Section 6. Judicial Notice. That the judges of all State and Federal Courts are hereby given notice that possession of the designated Militia Rifles and accessories by citizens should not be restricted or infringed upon by State laws or the laws of a political subdivision of a State and any such law should be reviewed under the strict scrutiny standard to determine whether it is a violation of the Constitution of the United States after judicial consideration of this Order and the fact that it was issued by the Commander in Chief of the Militia.

That is the speculative proposed wording of an order to protect certain arms the Commander in Chief, President Trump, considers Militia suitable to garner them stronger protections under the Second Amendment.

The order has strong points and weak points to its design that I want to highlight.

Section 1.

Affirms the concept of the “Whole People” being the Militia.

Section 2.

Affirms the current administrations support for the U.S. Constitution, specifically the Second Amendment, and encourages the personal exercise of responsibility under it. It also calls out States that have highly restrictive laws and this seems to be most directly a result of the 4th Circuit ruling toward Maryland on their Assault Weapons Ban.

Section 3.

Definitions

Section 4.

Lists the “Militia Rifles” under Definition (f) from Section 3. AR15,  M1A, M1 Garand, “and similar rifles” as well as listing 5.56x45mm/.223 Remington ammunition, 7.62x51mm/.308 Winchester ammunition, and 30-06 ammunition. Also listed are bolt action rifles in those calibers.

Section 5.

Preemption, this EO is designed to directly dismantle state Assault Weapon Bans to a degree by cutting down most of the legal language listing these rifles as dangerous and/or unusual and classifying them as suitable.

Section 6.

Judicial notice is given to the state and federal courts to give credence to the preemption.

I want to emphasize again this is entirely speculative.

If implemented there would be several positive results. The most prominent are the legal challenges set to occur if the order were published and signed. Those gains would be substantial for the second amendment in several states.

But there are weaknesses and detriments to the order also and we need to highlight those to address, correct, improve, or remove them.

  • This is an EO, it can be rescinded by a new President or by the current one at will. It is not law and may create unexpected or unforeseen changes in the laws of the nation and various states. Because of the naming of specific firearms I see a patchwork ban and non ban list similar to Canada ‘s laws being feasible. For example is the SCAR17 similar enough to an AR15 or the M1A is it or is it not a “Militia Rifle” based on definitions. Based on my reading I’d say no it isn’t, despite it being a US service rifle.
  • Definitions and language. “and similar rifles” is vague and holds no meaning until someone gives it parameters. What those parameters will be is unknown and no guidance is provided. Will it be any semi auto firearm that can meet a caliber/capacity requirement or within given parameters meet requirements? Will it be up to states do decide exceptions or additions. Framework is necessary
  • Caliber listings. Seems to exclude less popular but still effective rounds even in named platforms. .300 AAC Blackout/7.62×35, 6.8x43mm SPC, 7.62x39mm. All pistol caliber carbines are also unlisted.
  • Made in America. This could end up excluding any 922r converted firearms even if they are suitable mechanically from all stand points
  • Preemption. An EO is not a law and the influence this could have or the impact is largely unknown
  • Judicial Notice. Again like the Preemption this is not law, its impact and scope of influence are largely unknown. The EO is kind of a sternly worded note…

I also want people to be expressly aware of repercussions. The wording of this gives ample opportunity for state and national legislatures to chase after greater restrictions non protected firearms with the full notice that the Trump administration, the Commander-in-Chief himself, does not believe they suit the requirements.

Food for thought guys. Carry on.

Preview: Citadel LMC by Hardened Arms

By
Keith Finch
-
Citadel LMC

Muzzle devices like most modern rifle accessories have a myriad of designs in use. Some are expertly designed and accomplish their intended roles, others are a pile of promises and no results… looking better than they perform.

For the most part a muzzle device can do one thing well, you have to choose. It’s the nature of expanding smokeless powder that redirecting it will have benefits and deteriments and you as the end user need to select carefully.

The Citadel LMC (Linear Muzzle Compensator) is one such device and it happens to suit a role I need perfectly. A hands on evaluation is in the works but let me highlight why end users, especially in the SBR community, should consider the Citadel.

Muzzle Devices, General Information

First a real quick run down on muzzle device designations. Names mean things. The effect during firing it mitigates can be found in the name, the effectiveness varies based on design and manufactorer.

  • Flash Hider: A muzzle device designed to direct expanding gasses to escape in a manner minimizing the visible signature. Hiding as much of the visible flash as possible to aid in concealment and lessen disruption of low light and night adjusted eyes.
  • Muzzle Break: A muzzle device designed to direct expanding gases rearward around the shooter and interrupt rearward recoil, reducing recoil felt by the shooter in the process.
  • Compensator: A muzzle device designed to direct the expanding gases to counter muzzle rise during recoil keeping the discharging firearm more level during recoil.

As stated earlier the best muzzle devices focus on one thing. In some cases two can be accomplished well. But any muzzle device reporting to do all three is likely poor at all three.

Back to the Citadel LMC. It’s a Linear Muzzle Compensator. As a compensator the Citadel LMC counters muzzle rise. It does not claim reduced recoil nor reduced muzzle flash signature, in the latter category quite the opposite is noted.

So why am I excited to test the Citadel LMC?

AAC 51T Breakout on my LWRC M6IC PSD

Short Barreled Rifles and the ever growing popularity of pistol style short barrels has shown a point of notice. As you shorten the barrel of a firearm more of the powder burn that is accelerating the round escapes from the muzzle after the round exits. What would hardly produce any signature in a 16 inch barreled rifle produces drastically more dramatic results through an 8 inch barrel. My AAC 51T Breakout is an excellent muzzle break but the amount of gas venting as the round exits needs to be noted.

  1. The amount of noise the shorter barrel generates is substantial, a break directs more of this noise towards the shooter and anyone near them and is half again as close as a conventional rifles muzzle, further increasing the noise.
  2. The increased powder burn off at the muzzle produces a lot of heat, flash, and gas that goes where it is directed to also. This direction is exactly the same as the increased noise.

The Citadel LMC address both of those by design. It channels the full force of expanding gases forward and up. The Linear Muzzle Compensator is designed to live up to its name and discharge directly forward of the shooter. This design reduces the noise, flash, heat, and gas  concussive impacts that are common on shorter barrels wearing muzzle breaks or conventional compensators.

10.5″ Barrel with 12″ Talon/TLN Handguard and Citadel LMC

In addition to those advantages directing all the gasses forward allows use of longer handguards. With the aluminum, carbon fiber, or any material not absording the direct venting of the gas a barrel can wear a longer freefloat handguard than its length. This can aid the shooter by providing longer sight radius, more mounting surface, and more comfortable popular shooting positions.

I’m looking forward to getting my hands on this and evaluating the differences it makes while shooting.

If you’re interested check out http://www.hardenedarms.com/ecCat_84 for the full Citadel LMC line up

Stay tuned for the T&E

 

 

Oh and if you like fireballs like I do. Hardened Arms promises this delivers, just not towards you any more.

Keith Finch GAT Daily’s New Editor

By
248 Shooter
-

Dear GAT Readers,

As many of you may have noticed there are some subtle mostly behind the scenes changes going on at GAT Daily and GAT Marketing. These changes are being executed to continue to provide you all with superb content that is above all else entertaining and informative.

With that GAT Marketing is proud to officially announce the Editor-in-Chief brought on to facilitate that content mission.

Keith Finch

Keith had been quietly integrated into the GAT Marketing fold a couple months ago to keep things rolling. In that busy time period we never actually acknowledged he was here… mainly because he forgot the announcement project among the other projects on deck.

But here we finally got to it!

Keith comes from a military shooter background. Enlisted in 2006 in the United States Marine Corps he served with the reserve component 1/24 A Co. as a rifleman through squad leader. In 2009 he became a certified firearms and safety instructor through the National Rifle Association, holding rifle, pistol, shotgun, and chief range safety officer credentials. In 2014 he left the service but teaching concealed carry civilian side kept him close to the shooting industry and the military. In 2016 he reenlisted and went into Army Ordnance, Small Arms Repair, to further round out his firearms background.

The shooting and firearms technology industries have been Keith’s pursuit in one form or another for over a decade starting back with the XM8 service rifle project and looking forward to the rifles, sidearms, shotguns, and sights of 2017 and beyond.

From Keith:

“I’m looking forward to bringing you readers continued content from around the industry at the highest quality. Original reviews, previews, training, and anything we can get our hands on here at GAT Marketing to show you all we will. Stay tuned and thanks for reading!”

Keith R Finch

Editor-in-Chief GAT Marketing
MCRGO Certified Instructor
NRA Certified Instructor/CRSO

We Like Shooting 178 – #shawnaniguns

By
We Like Shooting
-

Welcome to the We Like Shooting show, Episode 178 – tonight we’ll talk about Howling Raven, Rustic Ridge, Texas, Mission First Tactical, UM Tactical, the Gun Collective and more!

Owner of Patton Media and Consulting as well as Owner of The Gun Collective and host of TGC News.

You can find more about Jon Patton here

Our cast for episode 178 is Shawn Herrin, Aaron Krieger, Savage1r, Jeremy Pozderac, Nick Lynch! We are also joined by Ava Flanell from Elite Firearms & Training

If you carry or use a gun to protect yourself an/or your family then you need Second Call Defense. They handle what comes after the trigger is pulled. Don’t wait until it’s too late. Get Second Call Defense today!

Get a free month and a free We Like Shooting mug when you sign up! Once you are signed up forward your email confirmation to automated@welikeshooting.com to get your mug!

Our female panelist talks about gear and issues for women in the gun world.

Purse’s

Reality based accessories that solve problems! Manticore Arms makes parts for your fighting rifles, whether it’s an AK, AR-15, AUG, Tavor, CZ Scorpion Evo or even something else!

Get 10% off at Manticore Arms with code WLS10!

Brought to you by DEZ Tactical Arms

Where we talk about the stuff we have, the stuff that we want and the stuff that we need!

Rifles and accessories for the AR-15 lover! Whether you need a full rifle or just parts to build one DEZ has your back. High quality, match grade and most parts are made in house.

Get 10% off at DEZ Tactical Arms with code WLSPATRON!

The absolute best ammo we’ve shot! Match grade primers, match grade powder, virgin brass and top quality projectiles, at range ammo prices. You have got to see it to believe it!

Get $5 off at JC Arms and Ammunition with code WLS5OFF!

Brought to you by JC Arms & Ammunition

Savage1r goes over the news of the day relating to guns, rights and more!

Learn how to be a gunsmith in the comfort of your own home. Distance learning that gives you tools and a gun in a box to build as you learn! Whether you want to get more acquianted with your AR-15 or want an associates degree, SDI is the place for you.

Mention We Like Shooting!

Please leave us reviews in iTunes! It makes all the difference!

New Years resolutions for the hosts

by Viking kydex bender on Dec 27, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

I took it upon myself to come up with a few resolutions for all of the hosts in the new year : Nick : the car thing isn’t really working out. Maybe try a bicycle or a scooter, public transport is always a option. No one should go through as many vehicles as you have.Savage : try caffeine. Also try limiting your Reddit re-reads to two thousand words or less. We will all thank you. Ava: your my favorite part of the show, blink twice during the entire course of the show if you want my number Aaron: it’s probably time for you to come to terms with your inevitable foot loss. Resolve to actually shoot something while your hunting before that happens Jeramy: your New Years resolution should be to finally come out of the Bigfoot size closet you have staying in. We get it you choke dudes Shawn : your resolution should be to finally start writing your Nobel prize acceptance speech. You are the nicest person ever and are truly wonderful as the host of the we like shawn I mean shooting show.

Dont forget your Towel?

by towely on Dec 27, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

Hey Savage… you want to get high?  

Rogue one

by Jyn Erso on Dec 27, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

So is Jeremy like Vader? I mean he does choke people out all the time… and I am pretty sure in his younger years he was pretty gay.

Buffalo bill.

by Jame Gumb on Dec 27, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

Ava I have noticed you have been getting a little bigger since you started on the show… this is great, you will make a great skin suit.

The absolute best in patches and 2A shirts!

Get 15% off using code WLS!

Winners!

Didn’t win? Enter here!

We’re here live every week on Monday nights and on demand every Thursday. Go to welikeshooting.com/show to subscribe!

Source: https://welikeshooting.com/show/178/

The Sound of Silence: H.R. 367

By
248 Shooter
-

For those who are quietly interested in silencers/suppressors gaining moment towards coming off of the National Firearms Act. Rep Jeff Duncan reintroduced a version of the Hearing Protection Act, Monday Jan 9 to the House Ways and Means and Judiciary committees.

I for one am looking forward to tracking H.R. 367’s momentum and see it passed allowing those of us that shoot to hear a little better, be more courteous of the noise to our neighbors, and just because its cool.

To be clear. It has not passed and this is not a law… yet.

Track H.R. 367 here at https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/house-bill/367?r=21

Let’s help support the sound of silence.

defensive firearm training
Author and CMMG .300 AAC BLK SBR with SilencerCo Omega

Source Article from http://248shooter.com/index.php/sound-silence-h-r-367/

Repealing the NFA: Update

By
Keith Finch
-

Readers,

On February 19th of this month a petition on the White House official page calling for repeal of the National Firearms Act of 1934 closed for signatures…

 

 

258,833 people signed

 

More than twice the necessary number to elicit an official response from the Executive Branch.

While this is only a small measure and could result in a “we’ll look into it” response it puts the federal government on notice that we as gun owners are actively seeking to shape the policies that surround our Second Amendment rights and to remove now asinine limitations and regulations.

This petition was a great first step and will put the Trump administration on record with a response. The potential is there for this to be one of the most Pro-2A administrations in a long time but it will only follow through if we continue to put that pressure on through written notice, education, and vigilance of the issues. There are still plenty of 2A opponents out there who refuse outright to use logic and reason to form objective opinions and still swing the effective emotional outrages around to get the visceral votes to pass terrible legislation.

This is another great step.

But we’re on a ruck march…

Packs on Ladies and Gentlemen, this won’t be easy. It will be worth it.

500 Rounds of 9mm 115 RN for $99

By
248 Shooter
-

This round is our staple it is the first caliber we tooled up in, and we make a lot of it!

The brass for our 9mm is fully processed before loading and hand inspected before the process even starts! This round like all of our products is built using only premium components, here at Detroit Bullet Works we do not use any surplus powders or primers to build our ammunition. The powders we use often times are better than those of many OEM manufacturers, producing a cleaner, better cycling round!

9MM 115 GRAIN RN

  • 115 grain (Plated)
  • Powder: Titegroup©
  • Bullet: Berry’s
  • Primer: CCI© or Winchester
  • Case: Remanufactured
  • Muzzle Velocity: 1200fps
  • Muzzle Energy: 375 ft-lbs

Source: http://www.detroitbulletworks.com/9mm-115-grain-rn/

Optics Review: LUCID P7 PCO

By
Keith Finch
-

The LUCID P7 Prismatic Combat Optic is a fixed four power magnification MSR optical option that seeks to bridge the gap between low priced budget glass and the premium grade operational optics. That particular field is sparely populated and LUCID was kind enough to send me a P7 to see what they offered. They had every confidence in their scope so I gave it the royal treatment and placed it head to head against the ACOG.

LUCID said go for broke, we went.

First let’s spec out both optics and see what the numbers tell us.

The P7

The P7 PCO lists the following specifications:

  • Housing and Frame: Cast Aluminum
  • Weight: 19 oz.
  • Mounting: 13mm hex nuts, reversible
  • Lenses: 25mm Ocular with manual focus, 30mm Objective
  • Optic Coating: Chemical Rubber Armor
  • Power: 1 AA Battery (not included), estimate 2,500 hours life, 2 hour auto shut off
  • Reticle: P7, Red Illumination, automatic and manual brightness adjustment, 10 settings
  • Waterproof and Nitrogen Purged recoil rated to .458 SOCOM
  • Adjustments: ½ MOA clicks with resettable thumb turrets, hex wrench included for reset
  • Field of view: 25ft at 100 yards
  • Eye Relief 3.25”
  • Warranty: Limited Lifetime

The ACOG TA02

IMAG0391
TA31 ECOS was used in live testing

The most direct comparison would be against the LED illuminated TA02 but the TA31 was on hand for side by side. The TA02 lists the following.

  • Housing and Frame: Forged 7075-T6
  • Weight: 18.1 oz. with AA battery
  • Mounting: TA51 thumb screw mount, reversible
  • Lenses: 32mm objective lens, multicoated
  • Optic Finish: Hard Coat Anodized, optional colors and coatings
  • Power: 1 AA battery, 6 brightness settings with off positions between each, 12,000 hours (setting 4)
  • Reticle: 4 options, bullet drop compensator .223, red or green illumination
  • Waterproof and Purged: 100 meter depth, dry nitrogen
  • Adjustments: 2 clicks per inch at 100 yards, ½ MOA
  • Field of View: 36.8ft at 100 yards
  • Eye relief: 1.5”
  • Warranty: Lifetime

Now as we analyze the numbers the ACOG sports several that outshine the P7. But for some final perspective on the optics here are the price tags.

The TA02 ACOG has retail value of $1,548.00

The P7… $439.00

With that $1109.00 disparity I can field three rifles with a P7 per one ACOG or purchase a rifle and a P7 for the retail price of the TA02 standing alone. There’s significant appreciable value there.

Now, as an ACOG user and owner I can say the ACOG is worth every penny. But 110,900 extra pennies is a lot of pennies.

The control layouts on both optics are simple and effective.

IMAG0362

The P7 has a three button control pad on the left side of the housing and stores the AA battery in the base. The power button also sets the illumination mode from manual to auto brightness. The + and – set your manual brightness settings and are disabled when in auto brightness mode. The scope retains the last setting it was on when you power it off. Being an etched reticle design using illumination is optional and the fine center dot of the P7 reticle makes a fine point of aim on its own.

 

P74XReticle2

ACOG Reticle
ACOG Reticle

 

 

 

 

 

 

The TA02 houses it’s battery on the optic’s right side in an additoinal electronics housing. The rheostat is on the left and consists of a simple dial that clicks between your numbered brightness settings and the off positions. The TA02 also sports an etched reticle making the illumination optional.

TA02rheostat

Both favor a right handed shooter for manipulation with the LUCID’s controls being having slightly more complexity.

We Like Shooting 172 – Ummmmm Tactical

By
We Like Shooting
-

Welcome to the We Like Shooting show, Episode 172 – tonight we’ll talk about Full Conceal, I-594, Bubba’d 308’s, Stealth Arms 1911, Hi-Point 45, American Buffalo Knife and Tool, UM Tactical and more!

Design Engineer of UM Tactical

You can find more about Brian Wilson here

Our cast for episode 172 is Shawn Herrin, Aaron Krieger, Savage1r, Jeremy Pozderac, Nick Lynch! We are also joined by Ava Flanell from Elite Firearms & Training

If you carry or use a gun to protect yourself an/or your family then you need Second Call Defense. They handle what comes after the trigger is pulled. Don’t wait until it’s too late. Get Second Call Defense today!

Get a free month and a free We Like Shooting mug when you sign up! Once you are signed up forward your email confirmation to automated@welikeshooting.com to get your mug!

Our female panelist talks about gear and issues for women in the gun world.

easy ways for women to strengthen themselves for shooting. Grip training – stress ball, weight training – can of soup, trigger finger training – trigger trainer or spray bottle

Reality based accessories that solve problems! Manticore Arms makes parts for your fighting rifles, whether it’s an AK, AR-15, AUG, Tavor, CZ Scorpion Evo or even something else!

Get 10% off at Manticore Arms with code WLS10!

Brought to you by DEZ Tactical Arms

Where we talk about the stuff we have, the stuff that we want and the stuff that we need!

Rifles and accessories for the AR-15 lover! Whether you need a full rifle or just parts to build one DEZ has your back. High quality, match grade and most parts are made in house.

Get 10% off at DEZ Tactical Arms with code WLSPATRON!

The absolute best ammo we’ve shot! Match grade primers, match grade powder, virgin brass and top quality projectiles, at range ammo prices. You have got to see it to believe it!

Get $5 off at JC Arms and Ammunition with code WLS5OFF!

Brought to you by JC Arms & Ammunition

Savage1r goes over the news of the day relating to guns, rights and more!

Learn how to be a gunsmith in the comfort of your own home. Distance learning that gives you tools and a gun in a box to build as you learn! Whether you want to get more acquianted with your AR-15 or want an associates degree, SDI is the place for you.

Mention We Like Shooting!

Please leave us reviews in iTunes! It makes all the difference!

Great show

by SW41 on Nov 20, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

I really enjoy the show. It combines great information and great entertainment.

The best podcast

by Master_Panda on Nov 19, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

I look forward to the we like shooting podcast every week. Shawn needs to drink the same amount of Buffalo Trace bourbon that he did in episode 171 every podcast. It was truly entertaining. There is always a great amount of comedy along with some firearms facts and news. Ava is my favorite on the show and she is a goddess. As a 23yr old I dream of finding a girl like her. Shout out to Ava, you should come party in Nashville sometime! Overall great show, just subscribe.

Funniest show ever

by John_W_J on Nov 19, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

Good God this episode is the funniest ever

What Did I Just Witness?

by Negatively Neg-derac on Nov 18, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

I almost just changed my 5 star ITunes rating to a 1 star Yelp review. Did Nick just drive all the way to Colorado to sabotage the show? Nick brings back “whiskey” from a gun class and within 2 hours Sean’s life is ruined. Seriously, how do you still have sponsors? Nick, I know you like Hamlet but I didn’t think you’d actually do it! Now the show is damaged goods. You really should have thought about all of Jeremy’s hungry immigrant boy-toys before you selfishly attempted a coup.

You can’t make this stuff up

by Viking kydex bender on Nov 18, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

I would like to take a minute and congratulate Jeramy on his new position of head host ( check out episode 171 to see what I’m talking about) we like shooting is hands down the best podcast on the net today. It’s always super entertaining and full of great info on a huge variety of firearm related topics. The only suggestion I have is to rename the show the we like caniks/little dogs/choking people/diabetes/buffalo trace to better reflect the hosts themes and interests .

Funny and disturbing at the same time…

by Chrome Dude on Nov 16, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

Just found you guys and gal, so glad I did. Keep it up.

eoisode171

by Truett49 on Nov 16, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

Best show ever. You need to have more like it. Give out someone elses phone number next time.

Warning

by Tren Byington on Nov 15, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

Great show, but if they accidentally give out Aaron’s number live on the show do not, I repeat DO NOT text it. He will immediately start trying to Seduce you with pictures of himself on a bale of straw.Other that the unwanted pictures of Aaron it’s an amazing show.

Put in email about savage

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  • Blown Deadline: Victor Galbraith

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We’re here live every week on Monday nights and on demand every Thursday. Go to welikeshooting.com/show to subscribe!

Source: https://welikeshooting.com/show/172/

Defensive Firearm Training: Don’t Play the Odds

By
248 Shooter
-

I want to dissect some recent advice I came across that affects defensive firearm training.

The long and short of it was you, as a Concealed Carrier, do not need to practice doing reloads during your training and practical skills maintenance because you will “never” do one for real. This triggered a recall on the number of times I’ve seen, heard, and even given out advice about the odds of a particular occurrence during a defensive gun use. What I’ve seen recently though and what is concerning to me as an instructor and CPL holder is teaching people to frame their training against the odds instead of framing it to improve our levels of practical skills.

So lets ask ourselves a question.

What is the goal of defensive training?

Not the basic CCW/Concealed Carry class which cover your legal requirements to comply with the law, but further in depth defensive firearm training and techniques. What is that goal?

My goal is to push my failure point. Good defensive firearm training pushes your failure points to higher levels of base performance. They don’t center around what is most likely to happen in a “typical” Defensive Gun Use they focus on greater efficiency of base manipulation skills so they become easier to use under stress and you can problem solve better and more quickly.

If we data mine the typical stats of a defensive gun uses we find the encounter will be sudden, close, and over in seconds. I’ve heard “The Rule of 3’s” 3 Shots at 3 yards/meters in 3 seconds to encapsulate the idea of a “typical DGU”. This model is pulled from national crime stats across the nation. But while analyzing the averages we have to remember that nobody is average, no individual DGU is going to fit all the averages as a unique event it will be a mix of close and outlying data. In fact if we start trying to dig into average distances for police or civilian defensive encounters the data is elusive to non-existent beyond the anecdotal level. We’re left to develop our ideas off of security camera footage showing “bad breathe” distance robberies to the recent story out of Texas of a deputy ending a shoot out with a nearly 100 yard shot, one handed, while holding a horse… of course it’s Texas… but still. Another story you can dig up has a civilian aiding police with a nearly 200 yard shot… The stories are endless and varied.

So with that wide disparity of data on incidents we can’t define with any certainty what your target DGU training scenario should be based on distance, shooting style, scenario, etc. This is why police, the military, and civilian use of force/force on force training use a variety of reactive scenario training away from the firing line. This training is great, but it shapes your interactions not sharpens your shooting skills. All the UoF scenarios in the world won’t help you in a live fire situation that is out of your trained capabilities. In other words you may be clear on whether or not you should be shooting but haven’t developed the skills to make the shot, you have a skills disparity weighted toward the decision making aspect at the expense of the skill performance aspect.

So what should your training goals be? How do you become a more effective shooter under stress, under duress, with an ultimately unknowable scenario being the setting, and the cost of failure at that point being your life?

Actually it’s fairly simple. You improve your skills from yesterday. You push your effective range and speed with focused drills and objective scoring. You practice all aspects of weapon manipulation to become faster and more efficient at those manipulations.

Ignore the “typical DGU” because yours won’t be typical. Don’t train for typical.

Do you want to know how adjustable seats came about? Quick story time here, it has to do with averages.

The adjustable seat was invented for fighter pilots by doing a detailed survey of every pilot flying for the U.S. Military at that time to get the “average” seat that could fit everybody. What they got, at first, was a seat that fit nobody. Not a single pilot was average, the average person didn’t exist. So instead they made an adjustable seat that can encompass one end of the spectrum to the other of pilot physical dimensions.

Looking at DGU’s we see the same thing. Not one of them fits squarely into average. So since we aren’t average we must be adjustable and train for the widest range of probable occurrences. Am I advocating going out tomorrow and lock on a tactical repelling one handed shooting course? No. I did say probable. Train around your car, house, office, jogging trail, and any environment you frequent but most importantly train the basics that apply in ALL scenarios.

Think about defensive training like athletic training. You wan’t to improve your overall averages for each skill, not get a good score or number once and then assume it is repeatable indefinitely on demand. I want my draws to be consistently faster, my shots to be accurate from further, and to be able to push both those categories to their exhaustion limits with either or both hands while pushing that exhaustion/failure point to further and faster minimums.

That’s all ladies and gentlemen. Don’t be typical. Your fight won’t.

Source Article from http://248shooter.com/index.php/defensive-firearm-training-dont-play-the-odds/

Why Not Carry a Gun?

By
Keith Finch
-

From Michael Westra

Why Not Carry a Gun?

Everyone has their own reasons for carrying a firearm. Some carry to make a political statement, some because it is their constitutional right, others because they want to look cool, but most carry for security and protection. For the purpose of this article we are going to look into the security and protection aspect of carrying a firearm.

The world is ever changing, our population is growing, the economy is a giant roller coaster, and crime is on the rise. Turn on any television or pick up a newspaper and you will see several local and national stories of people being victimized by crime. Our legislators attempt to keep us safe by passing common sense feel good laws like “pistol, or gun free zones”, however it appears criminals do not care about breaking the law. Laws that prevent firearm use only keep honest, hardworking people like you and I from protecting our loved ones. Every year the FBI publishes a report called the “Uniform Crime Report”. The UCR is a nationwide cooperative effort of over 18000 police departments in the United States. Analysis of this data will tell us that 1 in 10 Americans will be involved in a violent crime at some point in their lives.

Knowing you or one of your immediate family members will likely be a victim of a violent crime how would you prepare? Where will that threat come from? When will that threat appear? How many attackers will there be? Who will come to your aid? Can you do anything to deter or prevent this from happening? Think about that for a moment. If you knew that tonight several thugs would break into your home and threaten you and your family how would you respond? What options do you have? If I knew ahead of time a crime was going to happen I would evacuate my family. The best way to stay alive is not be there. Realistically we don’t know when something like this will happen. The best we can hope for is to be prepared in case it ever does. What plans do you have in place to protect your home? What about if you were in a public place and not in your home? Look at some high profile incidents that have happened lately… In Orlando 49 people lost their lives to one dirt bag. Did those 49 people know that they would not be going home that night? I bet if they knew it was going to happen would they have stayed home. Two weeks ago in Kalamazoo, Michigan a man robbed a gas station, drove a couple miles down the road and attempted to burn down a home, drove a little further and started firing a gun into a home striking a resident in the chest. He then carjacked a car before leading police on a chase that ended in a crash. Last year an Uber driver randomly killed 6 people in that same town. All of his victims were random and scattered throughout the city. Two of them were shopping for new cars at the Ford dealership, another was watching her kids play on the playground of their apartment complex. A month ago people were gunned down at the baggage claim of an airport as they were getting ready to start their vacations. The randomness of these attacks brings to light the fact that a threat can come from anywhere at any time.

Whether we like it or not we are our own first responders. We will have to take it upon ourselves to protect our families. Most of us can’t afford to have a personal security detail follow us wherever we go. Most businesses can’t afford to have armed security to protect its patrons, and law enforcement has no duty to protect you as an individual….You read that correctly, the police have no legal obligation to protect. The US Supreme Court said law enforcement has no duty to protect individuals, only society as a whole. Read the events that led up to the Supreme Court decisions in Warren v. District of Columbia, or Castle Rock v. Gonzales, or Hartzler v. City of San Jose. Shocking isn’t it. So if the police have no duty to protect us even after calling 911 whose job is it? Who will step up and protect you and your loved ones?

You awake suddenly to the sound of glass breaking and voices in your home. You know people are in your house putting you and your family in danger. Your wife calls 911, assuming they respond in a timely manner how long will it be before they arrive? Five minutes, ten…thirty minutes, in some places it can be as much as an hour. In Detroit recently, police officers handed out flyers outside a Tigers baseball game warning visitors not to enter the city. Although this is on the extreme end even a 5 minute response feels like an eternity when you and your family are threatened. Stop and stare at a clock for 5 minutes, imaging what could happen in that time. Picture yourself enroute to your favorite vacation spot, your car blows a tire. You notice a van stop several car lengths behind you, the driver stays in the van while 3 men in hoodies get out with baseball bats, and tire irons. Who is coming to your aid? How long before they arrive? What’s your plan?

The UCR says a violent crime happens every 25.3 seconds somewhere in America. Only you can decide how you will prepare and respond. Does your plan involve fighting back? Are you prepared with the proper tools; firearm, mindset, and tactics? You have to be your family’s first responder.

So now I ask “Why not carry a gun?”

#mikeisawesome

Mike Westra is a friend of the editor. His background as a Pilot, Fortune 500 Corporate Safety Director, Deputy Sheriff, Firefighter, and Firearm Instructor has given him a breadth of perspective and experience that he shares to educate others.

Critical Firearm Cases To Be Heard By Michigan Court of Appeals

By
248 Shooter
-

 

By now it’s well known that Michigan law allows for firearms to be lawfully possessed in schools in various manners, and as you can imagine some schools are not happy about it. Rather than complying with the law, as their state funded positions require, they are instead looking for any way they can to push their anti-gun agenda. Their latest tactic is to claim that they are able to make their own rules that contradict state law,  regardless of the State’s well established scheme of preemption that puts what the State says above what lesser units of government say.

A little over 15 months ago, Circuit Court Judge Archie L. Hayman ruled in Genessee County in favor of Michigan Open Carry, Inc. and Kenneth Herman, that public schools are indeed preempted under Michigan law from making or enforcing their own rules banning the lawful possession of firearms. About a month later, Circuit Court Judge Carol Kuhnke ruled in Washtenaw County against Michigan Gun Owners and Ulysses Wong in a nearly identical case.

Both cases have been appealed to the Michigan Court of Appeals which will take them up next month. After a wait that seemed like it would never end, the Court of Appeals has finally scheduled oral arguments, for Tuesday, December 13th @ 10:00AM. 

See the Schedule of Arguments HERE.

Make no mistake, this is about more than just open carry or concealed carry.  The scope of Michigan’s firearm preemption hangs in the balance. If the courts don’t uphold preemption, then dozens of local authorities and similar entities will be able to ignore state law and make their own rules, even ones banning all firearms.

The ruling will also have a big effect on the 2017-18 legislative agenda. If the gun groups win, then it becomes increasingly likely that we will finally see a repeal of “Concealed Pistol Free Zones” (MCL 28.425o), and a strengthening of our current preemption laws. Conversely, if the gun groups lose, then such legislation will likely be put on hold until the Michigan Supreme Court weighs in, if they do at all.

Here is how you can help!

Support MOC and MGO in court – The media will surely be there and it is important that we stand together. There is no better way to do this than to do it literally. Join us in the courtroom and show the state that we are serious about preemption and we are serious about doing what the schools wont; protecting our children.

WHEN: Tuesday, December 13th at 10:00am
WHERE: District 1 – Detroit – 3020 West Grand Boulevard, Detroit – 14th Floor

* Public parking at daily and hourly rates is available at several locations within one block of Cadillac Place. Fisher Building public parking and the Victory parking lot are located at the corner of West Grand Boulevard and Third Avenue. New Center One public parking is located behind the St. Regis Hotel off of Lothrop. Additional parking is available off of Baltimore Avenue just west of Second Avenue.

* No firearms or electronic devices are allowed.

Donate – Cases like these are not easy to fight and it’s only because of the generous pro-gun community that we are able to keep pushing forward. Unlike those who are constantly looking to take away our rights, we are not funded by billionaire sugar daddies. Every little bit helps, and there is no donation too small.

Donate to MOC’s Legal Fund    |    Donate to MGO’s Legal Fund

Thank you from the bottom of our hearts to all of those who are able to help. We are proud to represent and fight on behalf of a true grassroots community.

Hold onto your butts and stay tuned. If you would like to receive future updates by email, subscribe to MOC’s Updates’s HERE.

Source Article from http://248shooter.com/index.php/critical-firearm-cases-heard-michigan-court-appeals/

We Like Shooting 173 – AK’s for days

By
We Like Shooting
-

Welcome to the We Like Shooting show, Episode 173 – tonight we’ll talk about Dara holsters, Smith & Wesson, Stealth Arms, Brownell’s, Hyve technologies, Krebs Custom and more!

premiere Custom AK manufacturers!

You can find more about Marc Krebs, Tom Corr and Simon here

Our cast for episode 173 is Shawn Herrin, Aaron Krieger, Savage1r, Jeremy Pozderac, Nick Lynch! We are also joined by Ava Flanell from Elite Firearms & Training

If you carry or use a gun to protect yourself an/or your family then you need Second Call Defense. They handle what comes after the trigger is pulled. Don’t wait until it’s too late. Get Second Call Defense today!

Get a free month and a free We Like Shooting mug when you sign up! Once you are signed up forward your email confirmation to automated@welikeshooting.com to get your mug!

Reality based accessories that solve problems! Manticore Arms makes parts for your fighting rifles, whether it’s an AK, AR-15, AUG, Tavor, CZ Scorpion Evo or even something else!

Get 10% off at Manticore Arms with code WLS10!

Brought to you by DEZ Tactical Arms

Where we talk about the stuff we have, the stuff that we want and the stuff that we need!

Rifles and accessories for the AR-15 lover! Whether you need a full rifle or just parts to build one DEZ has your back. High quality, match grade and most parts are made in house.

Get 10% off at DEZ Tactical Arms with code WLSPATRON!

The absolute best ammo we’ve shot! Match grade primers, match grade powder, virgin brass and top quality projectiles, at range ammo prices. You have got to see it to believe it!

Get $5 off at JC Arms and Ammunition with code WLS5OFF!

Brought to you by JC Arms & Ammunition

Savage1r goes over the news of the day relating to guns, rights and more!

  1. Classy Betsy Riot, led by radical feminist English professors ‘makes friends’ with lawmakers.
  2. Harvey Weinstein, producer of Six, Kill Bill 3, Omerta, The Crow, The, Untouchables, Jane Got a Gun, The Hateful Eight, Sin City: A Dame to Kill For, and more is releasing two anti-gun dramas aimed to ‘take down the NRA.The last two anti-gun movies, ‘Is that a gun in your pocket’ and Chi-raq have gone over like a lead balloon, looking forward to these flopping as well. They’re reading straight from the playbook and failing miserably.
  3. Despite all previous expectations, black Friday breaks all previous records for gun sales, beating 2015 by nearly 400 sales.
  4. Ava – Some Black Friday gun sales were lower than what I can get guns at cost for. Are these online retailers screwing over the ma and pop shops? Shouldn’t there be an unwritten rule about pricing or am I being a little bitch?

Learn how to be a gunsmith in the comfort of your own home. Distance learning that gives you tools and a gun in a box to build as you learn! Whether you want to get more acquianted with your AR-15 or want an associates degree, SDI is the place for you.

Mention We Like Shooting!

Please leave us reviews in iTunes! It makes all the difference!

How Drunk (and Dumb) Can Shawn Get?

by aggiesam1983 on Nov 24, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

Shawn you need to lay off the Buffalo Trace a little bit but I guess I understand why you were drinking so much after Nick finally made it to Colorado. But really, even as drunk as you were how could you be so dumb to give out your actual cell phone to a bunch of also drunk morons like us that will be texting you for years to come? I think Jeremy and Ava are secretly dating, no way they could be so mean to each other if they are not? What happened to Lil, did she get tired of you guys being guys? Bring her back, Ava could use another girl to counter you guys.How about having Carl from the Gundudes on as a guest, he would fit in well with y’all?Keep up the great show, I just became a Patreon since I am enjoying my weekly dose of great information and stupidity combined. Sam

Awe..

by Paulie 5.56 on Nov 22, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

Felt sorry that you had no reviews last week so here.. 👊👊👊

Reviewing from the rooftop

by 124124134 on Nov 21, 2016
RATING: ★★★★★

Hi, everyone.Hope you all survived the drunken trainwreck that was last episode.You have a great podcast that I look forward to hearing every week.You always manage to provide thoughtful opinion and well laid out information against the background of riot, havoc and profanity.I hope the show continues evolving without losing its genuine character and uniqueness.No slams against any of you even in fun today, just a straight up vote of appreciation.Thanks!

The absolute best in patches and 2A shirts!

Get 15% off using code WLS!

Winners!

Didn’t win? Enter here!

We’re here live every week on Monday nights and on demand every Thursday. Go to welikeshooting.com/show to subscribe!

Source: https://welikeshooting.com/show/173/

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